I have a horse and donkey. So I would rather rake and sweep. Jini Patel Thompson is a natural health writer and Lazer Tapping instructor. A barn I had advised on brought in a chipper to make custom chips this size. . My own experience (keep reading) confirms this. ft. ($53.81 /case) $5.07 Save 20% ( 139) Model# GDRCOBRG Merola Tile Coppa Brown Gold 12 in. OR perhaps you live in a region that just gets occasional downpours or flooding, so you dont think youll need the geotextile layer, or the same layers of rock/gravel. appreciate your thoughts on this. Part 2. The result is a durable, all-weather surface that is acceptable for animals.. However, if you can get them small enough (usually 3/8 5/8) to filter through the tines of your manure fork, that will make scooping poop much easier and reduce gravel wastage. And in a paddock entryway with 8 inches total of gravel/crusher. I ended up having to remove that entire layer and use it as fill elsewhere. I would definitely wait until August and do it then. Best article ever- I needed up making it a little simpler and doing geo textile then 6 in granite fines and have no mud in my barn yard- Every one of my 11 horses knows this. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. I guess it goes back for centuries in the European countries and the lady that wrote the list was from Scotland. When choosing gravel, pea gravel, or limestone gravel, most experts say you should get crushed rock particles no larger than 3/4-inch, or they are not comfortable for the horses to stand on. I have put rubber mats down on every different gravel footing Ive tested and they always move and become uneven. $ 30 - Crushed Concrete Base (Base layer of new driveways, binds w dirt) $ 32 - Crushed Concrete 610 (Mix of 1 rock down [] And that should be no problem for their hooves either its such a short time. What does minus mean, when referring to gravel? Of course you can always start with that and if its not enough, then add more on top. I was interested to see if it would work, as a woman had written in (who also lives in this Pacific Northwest climate) to tell me that its never worked for her horses. If you can afford concrete I would 100% go with that!! My 2 boys dont poop in their 24 x 36 paddock area so I cant comment on how much base I lose to a manure fork. Oh, and even though I added a new portable shelter for them, so they could stand outside to eat, this rain cover did not prevent the gravel from sinking into the ground around the slow feeders by April; just from the wear and tear of their hooves without any rainfall on it. Which made me think nursery pallets > easier and cover more space and probably a lot cheaper. See the video at the end of this post here from a woman who also has 2 acres: https://www.listentoyourhorse.com/how-to-make-a-great-waterhole-for-your-paddock-paradise-or-pasture/, Or, this permaculture system: In that case, I think it would depend on how your drainage is set up from your stalls A barn with good drainage probably requires a different material under the mats, than a stall with poor/no drainage. And repeat, ongoing. The most popular material for dog potty areas is, without a doubt, pea gravel. It needs to be 6-12. My arena is also used as the dry area on wet days and overnight hours, I am very happy with my surface. What is your thoughts of the grids and french drains? Next, on top of the 3 rock, spread another 5 inch deep layer of 3/4 inch minus gravel (sometimes called Road Base). Granite Base. Im curious to know if you ended up redoing the paddock surface area this year again? All your information is invaluable, thank you very much. It can pack into a hard surface with limited drainage capacity. https://www.listentoyourhorse.com/equine-permaculture-in-rainy-climates-system-for-sustainable-pastures/, https://www.listentoyourhorse.com/adventures-in-culvert-drainage-for-my-horse-paddock/, Ginny Interviews Jini for the Interspecies Evolution Podcast, Montaros Emancipation My Freedom is Your Freedom, Heart Opening Meditation with the Herd & Land, Montaros Journey: Healing the Wounded Angry Masculine, Messages from Burdock (Burrs), Raven & The Herd, The Herd Out My Window Esoteric Musings, Laminitis, Cushings, Founder Healing Session for Your Horse, Pain, Injury, Competition Brainwashing & Dissociation, The Geography of Belonging Horses & Love in Zimbabwe. 1. You first have to put a commercial-grade shielding material used in road building like Nilex down on the soil and then lay down the 3-inch rock or recycled concrete (often cheaper), and then the gravel. One thing that I did and would highly recommend is after having the 3 minus delivered we rented a 1000 lb plate compactor and compacted the arena surface for a full week, many, many, many times. I havent read all of it yet, but for raking leaves that is very labour intensive I would suggest a leaf blower. Let me know how it goes! Adding a dedicated parking area to your property helps you to accommodate guests and protects your yard from tire damage. yd. However, on the flip side of that argument, here's what a Farrier has to say about why she prefers crusher dust: "As a farrier, my favourite footing in this area is crusher dust. 3. This dust forms a cement-like bond when compacted. Because a farrier with lots of experience with it says its too acidic for the horses hooves. Well first of all, paths dont need any less treatment than your barn yard if you want them to say mud-free. Thats a relief. One of the most important considerations for many people is the cost of the material, but there is good news with crushed gravel because it's one of the more affordable driveway options available. Or email them to me and Ill upload them: service@listentoyourhorse.com And do you have any pics of the barn you never had to dig out? yd.) As youve shown, it doesnt hold up well, but its not expensive to replenish here ($250 per 16k lbs.). Im open to hear any new tips you may have to for my situation. Can be used for landscaping, back fill and mixing concrete. You can then layer it with geocell to prevent pooling and unstable ground. Make sure you dont get smooth-edged crusher though it needs to have the jagged/irregular edges to pack properly. Top layer: Crusher Dust, But if not, then youre going to have to put down either geotextile cloth, or the plastic grid mats and then lay your gravel. Heres what it looked like after the two truckloads of 3/4 inch gravel was spread out: I was happy with this for a few days, and then I started fretting about the fact that there really wasnt much room for them to move around and exercise, yet stay on the gravel. Might be a case of dont ask apologize later if you have to Some of those bylaws are aimed at developers though and they may not bother with small usage it varies though, some are more rabid dog about it. Your email address will not be published. It would also seem to be easy to clean. I would still do the Nilex barrier cloth as the bottom layer though, and clear down to hardpan. Thank you so much for your extended read! I only had the farrier out once this entire year and even then one of the horses didnt need anything the rest of the time they either self-trimmed or I helped them out with a touch-up here and there. Plain pea gravel or limestone costs $28 to $45 per ton. Using these products together will prevent freezing by allowing for proper drainage without needing a french drainage system. Btw, did a little research on star thistle as I hadnt heard of it, and I think the important point here is how MUCH the horse would have to consume to be negatively affected: The exact chemical compound responsible for toxicity in Russian knapweed and yellow star-thistle has not been defined; however, a sesquiterpene lactone, repin, is believed to be the key neurotoxin present. If you had a docile herd of 2-3 horses you would likely be just fine. And what you used. This layer of stone is your simulated bedrock, and it's the foundation of your new driveway. But if your horses have slow feeders in their walk-in shelters, that is not an issue. This was an important step because without it the large 3 minus rocks will slowly start to surface to the top and will need to be picked before riding / turnout. Divide your answer (cubic feet) by 27 to get the number of cubic yards you need. It gets as wet as the paddock, so the same footing will probably be best. That is a good idea however I have an intense dislike of the noise of leaf blowers! Im so happy I found your website! They said it packs down better than pea gravel in the rain, there are less of the tiny stones to get stuck in the horses hooves, and its easy to shovel manure off of. Adding sand won't work and will likely worsen your sticky situation. For my super rainy climate (the Pacific Northwest coast) after trying cheaper variations and having to spend an additional $2,000 on gravel every year, because it just kept sinking I finally hired my friend Mitchell, who gets the commercial-grade barrier material from Nilex, to come in and do it right for me. A couple of months ago (prior to reading this) I leveled the walkout paddock area and laid pea gravel 6 deep under the roof and 4 beyond which will be exposed to a lot of rain in winter. You might also want to look into the Paddock Paradise, or, Walking Track system. parts of the Pacific Northwest and the U.K., is that there is no hard compacted soil, or shale, or rock beneath the topsoil! Growsource supplies and delivers gravel and rock products for projects of all sizesfrom five to 10 yards (depending on the delivery area) at a time. Please let us know how it goes for you. And I would think youd want to use sharper-edged gravel (not smooth) so it can bite into the limestone and hold I discovered this by adding a load of smooth gravel on top of my crusher dust (1/4 gravel) to see what would happen, and it just slid around and was useless. To ensure adequate drainage for the stable when using any type of flooring, elevate the top of the stall floor at least 12 inches above the outside ground level. But as I pointed out above, examine the crusher before you order it, to make sure it is just crushed rock fines and doesnt contain any clay particles. e.g: 500 square feet x .5 feet depth = 250 cubic feet. Larry. Now I can focus on other things (water, feeders, trailer, star thistle, fences)! I am in the UK. I like the fines so far for helping with the mud, but for sure am trying a longer term solution. He was stunned by the county thinking gravel is non permeable and says they are dead wrong. Limestone crushed to the 1- and 1/2-inch size, mixed with pulverized limestone, can be used as the layer between the soil and the stone blocks according to the J. This hole area is low. Wouldnt have cost much extra, but would have greatly extended the life of the gravel I ordered. I havent tried it myself. Save my name, email, and website in this browser for the next time I comment. Middle: 3/4 minus gravel I will say, that year was the worst for rain weve had in a decade or so tons of houses had their basements flooded for the first time ever. I wish I had better news for you. The water will travel through the rocks or gravel before entering the pipes. Cover the fabric with a 4- to 5-inch layer of crushed #1 or #2 limestone rocks. Before we get into the materials we use for a hot tub base we need to first. BLACK BASALT CRUSHED ROCK (1/2") Decomposed Granite. I have been debating over whether i need Geo-textile or not, as some areas are fairly hard but some seem to have some clay In muddy areas, perhaps you would even start with 2-4 quarry spalls (basically what you refer to as a 3 clean rock; clean means doesnt have fines). Thank you for your great article!!! The Bahama product is a coral based limestone type rock it is not harvested as live coral it is basically rock mined like any other rock product and is then shipped and widely used for landscape purposes such as driveways and underneath pavers. Absolute BEST Barn Design for Horses or Cows Cold or Heat! Dr. Ann Swinker (professor of Equine Sciences) says: Ideally a two layer footing system works best when working with gravel. Call 360-318-8554 to order rock or gravel delivered in Whatcom County. Your site is so inspiring and YOU are so generous! You may also be able to get away with just doing 3/4 minus and then 1/4 crusher dust if your subsoil (hardpan) is hard and not too deep. 1. How to Manifest the Land of Your Dreams Part 3. I didnt use a membrane and probably would in the future. See more related content in our article about, Pros and Cons of Prefinished Hardwood Flooring. Will dogs poop on pea gravel? Or should I risk making even more mud and do it now? We just had our stable built, with excavation down to the hard soil. Most plants like to grow in soil that is slightly basic, or in other words, has a pH above 7.0. Great info Donna thanks so much for sharing your knowledge! Many people refer . You can order bulk limestone in Virginia today! white rabbit restaurant menu; israel journey from egypt to canaan map crushed limestone for muddy yard. But she said she wouldnt use the crusher dust again, since it packs down like cement. Thanks for the discussion. I have friends who have used almost the same formula but without the compacting and have to pick the rocks regularly (at least weekly, if not more often). We are going to try a small portion of one horses paddock in a different material and Im considering the drainage panels you mentioned. You have to pick up manure everyday but so worth it. I totally understand that opinions are just that but yours is certainly very informed. Great article. Lets start with these pictures of my first set-up, where I self-boarded my horses on a friends property, and my adventures in paddock footing began. If you do it right the first time, you may only have to do the underlayers once (as long as you keep organic matter off your paddock surface) and then top up with crusher dust every couple of years. Its the best info Ive found. Its uses include: On Bike Paths. But, if its drier and they do lie down in there, then yes, a really small, smooth pea gravel or sand would be WAY more comfy for them. Since I am not a millionaire, and Im weighing in on what direction to go, the gravel layers actually seems pretty affordable with less maintenance. Applying straw, pine shavings, or organic mulch to a muddy yard is an excellent temporary remedy. Thanks for the interesting discussion. It consists of a coarse aggregate base and a finer cover layer. Sorry I havent seen or experimented with stall footing. The one thing you notice when youre trying to price out gravel or crusher dust, is that pricing tends to be in cubic yards. The perforated pipes may then drain far enough away from your yard to be safe. Another consideration: If you live in a dry climate with little rain, the dust particles in the crusher dust can work themselves deep into your horses mane and coat. Because this is the most informative article Ive read I was curious what you would recommend under stall mats. Spreading temporary ground cover for mud, like pine flakes, crushed limestone, or feline litter, will absorb the mud and also allow you to shovel it bent on remove the excess water. , Post a before and after pic when youre done Joanna (with your sheep in it!) Rip rap is large nearly boulder-size crushed stone. Now lay a layer of large rock or recycled concrete (3 inches wide or larger rock) on top of the Nilex barrier, about 5 inches deep. Ive never seen 3-inch woodchips for sale anywhere in the Vancouver area. Thanks for your time. More Miracles in the Singing Horse Matrix, Christmas & New Year 2021 Message from Singing Horse Herd, LTYH Podcast: Non-Verbal Observation & Acknowledgment, Connect Deeper with the Singing Horse Herd, Horse Wisdom: Who Are You, REALLY? Please feel free to share your experience and experiments in the Comments section below. It also lasts far longer than mulch. Thanks for the great advice, now I have no more muddy mess around the barn! I have been on two rental properties and each time didnt think it was worth doing the geotextile, but even if you only stay 2 years, its worth it. And I will move them to the field next to it. Obviously droppings always need removing. They can get a little waterlogged mid winter and usually it means they are old and not as absorbant and I take the depth down. Not only does this make them very hard to brush clean, but the particles are super fine dust that occasionally irritate the horses eyes and are certainly not healthy for you or your horse to be inhaling. 250 cubic feet divided by 27 = 9.25 cubic yards. RECYCLED ASPHALT. Mitchell uses the Nilex 4551 Non-woven Geotextile when he builds horse trails in provincial parks. So yes, it will work in this climate (I tried it) but it will only work for one winter. . My big constraint with my first horse boarding set-up was that it is not my own land, I didnt have a long-term lease, and so realistically, I could be kicked out at any time. If you live in a climate that only gets occasional rain, or a short rainy season, then you may be able to just lay either a commercial-grade shielding fabric or a specialized plastic draingrid on top of the hard pan soil, then layer 2-4 inches of 3/4 inch minus pea gravel and top that with a 2-inch layer of 1/4 inch minus limestone gravel, or crusher dust. My questions are as follows: if I use your advice of geotextile fabric with layers of gravel am I going to get washing of the fine gravel on the slopes with heavy rain? AND does it need the same amount of drainage capacity as your paddock, or less? A local farmer grows willow (hardwood and quick growing) which is not poisonous and originally chipped it for power stations but they had special moisture parameters he could not meet. I am considering granite stone dust or 89 Bahama at the moment which is a crushed coral product from its namesake. 2. Thank-you! The other stuff is too loose and just moves out of the way like pea gravel. Since I have not prepped the paddock surface and the gravel will be dumped straight on the grass, I decide to order 39 tons of 3/4 inch minus gravel from Fraser Valley Aggregates. I tend to scrape old chips off at end of summer because with wind and sun a lot naturally disappear. The more frisky/active your horses are, the more they tear up the gravel. You can also examine the crusher dust and see which suppliers contains the least amount of dust. So I want to lay down some kind of surface footing that will encourage water drainage and help keep my horses hooves drier, so we can avoid thrush and other hoof problems that are common in this rainy climate. They have a program that subsidizes horse owners to improve drainage. Why Do The Horses Always Have Better Ideas Than Me? Only a few dont fall through. When you say horse rooms Im assuming you mean stalls or stables? 20 Results Brand: Merola Tile Indoor/Outdoor: Outdoor Clear All Sort by: Top Sellers Get It Fast In Stock at Store Today Cumberland & nearby stores Next-Day Delivery Please choose a rating 1.0k $406 /sq. Excellent article, and appreciate the before and after pics. As the hogfuel ages and the acid leaches out, it turns sloppy and is a fantastic host for bacteria so again, another problem to deal with.. So I called them up and ordered 45 tons of 1/4 inch minus crusher dust with squared edges (not sharp) and had that spread on the remaining half of the paddock. Ive also had a few that you had to be careful even with thumb pressure because that was enough to poke a hole through the sole.). With an older or sedate herd, maybe youd only have to top up once ever 2-3 years. It is mainly used in applications by bodies of water, which is why you commonly see it along streams, rivers and similar locations. My horses dont wear shoes. At the base its currently just packed dirt. How thick does each layer need to be? Best to get new woodchips and not from a poisonous tree and without any greenery. The 1/4 minus, which will mix in with the 3/4 gravel over time, gives hooves a great self-trimming tool. My mare has Cushings and sometimes laminitis. The gravel and/or crusher dust only lasts one season and so you have to pay out the same amount every year. 74.9 million tons used for cement manufacturing and the share of limestone are significant in it. One word of caution: Ive been using it for 6 years, no problems, but recently, recently, almost lost one of my horses to colic. It keeps their feet in the best shape of all the footings Ive dealt with. Thanks so much Eve, for stopping by and adding your wisdom/experience to this conversation much appreciated! So if your paddock usually turns into 5 inches of mud, then use 5 inches of footing. Every bit of feedback is useful , Hi! Heres a full list of inch to feet conversions so you can figure out the depth of gravel you want for your calculation in step #1 above: 1 inch equals .083 feet Rip rap is an aggregate that will perform in the harshest outdoor conditions. Someone suggested gravel or crushed limestone, but 1) I don't really want a bunch of little rocks in my yard where I have to mow right next to them and have it throw a rock up at me and 2) I think the dogs could slip on it or, perhaps worse, run another mud path right before the limestone. If the supplier charges by the yard, then the costs can be about $27 . I have since left that boarding place, but the owners (who bought their own horses after being inspired by mine) did indeed dump 4 more boxes of crusher dust on that paddock ($1400). Okay, now that you know what to do Im going to tell you about all the options available and what other people say. Nilex is a worldwide company, but if you cant get that material, then just show your supplier the spec sheet and get them to match it. Here are a few reasons why crushed limestone can be a good choice. Usually its okay, but one year (same supplier) the crusher had clay in it and it completely packed down and stopped all drainage from happening! Crushed limestone gravel is relatively inexpensive and makes for an attractive, natural looking but durable walking surface. They are then free to honor their body wisdom and *listen* to their body because they are not in physical or psychological scarcity. Touring the world with friends one mile and pub at a time; best perks for running killer dbd. Fantastic information Pippa thanks so much for letting us know! I live in England and have winter paddocks. If your horses are restricted to a small area, they may then start pulling on the cloth to play with it. Paths made of large limestone pavers are also popular, but with big slabs some considerations have to be taken into account. By the ton, the costs of crushed limestone will vary anywhere from $20 to as much as $30. I am curious as to what you went with if you could let us know. But thanks for sharing as Im sure others on here may love the tip . I have found your article here really helpful! You should definitely do that! It wouldnt be the most interesting thing Ive ever written, but it might be useful. Some horses freak out and run around, others are curious and want to look inside the bucket and cab, but either way, once they start working the horses move out of the way. This is really labor intensive and I totally did not anticipate the amount of leaf raking I was going to have to do! But by April, the area around the slow feeders was wet and mucky. And it will drain even less well if its quarried rock rather than crushed drain rock. I have lost so much gravel from throwing it out with the manure, I highly suspect well need to put down a load of crusher dust after scraping/grading this year. To find out more, visit the limestone page on the website or, to get . Im mulling the idea of doing a video/blog post just about gravel terminology and what its called in different areas. Good sleep is an important part of a happy, healthy horse. A muddy backyard in a small property can be solved with ease by covering the mud with concrete. As you can see from the 2 photos directly above, it is much easier to rake all the leaves off of the crusher dust. He also uses a roller/compactor to really compress and lock the rock together into a nice firm surface that is not disturbed by punchy horse hooves. But as mine are so hard on footing, and theres so many of them lunging around, I have to level and add more crusher every year or two. The size ranges from 1 to 3 and ultimately best from a company that screens it for horse gallops (Dormit woodfibre in UK supplies a lot for arenas and gallops). Mix the Soil-Cement. However, at my current property, after doing everything exactly right, with the commercial-grade barrier cloth and all the right layers, by the end of the winter there were still craters and low spots in the footing. Wish I had better news for you! It doesnt matter how much they churn it up now, by end of June you wont notice a thing is amiss!
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